The No Fly Zone
Personally, I find Eli Rabett insufferable. And I know he thinks just as highly of me. But I wouldn’t question his patriotism. So I think it was wrong for Anthony Watts to take this cheap shot yesterday:
I wonder if “Tamino” or Eli Rabbet bothers to fly a flag on memorial day? Here’s to hoping that they do.
First of all, why should flying a flag be a test of someone’s patriotism? I know plenty of people who believe in god but don’t go to church or a temple. Does that mean they are atheists?
In the comment thread at WUWT, Watts offers a mea culpa, but not before digging himself in further, during this exchange with Brad Johnson, a blogger with the Center for American Progress (CAP).
BJ: Ha ha! Bloggers critical of you must hate America!
AW: Not neccessarily, but the way those two guys (Tamino and Rabbet) act sometimes, it does make one wonder. It would be refreshing to see them display some patriotism once in awhile, instead of a constant stream of invective and snark.
Yes, it would be refreshing to see less invective from the Rabbet, but that still doesn’t make me “wonder” about his patriotism, or why he should feel compelled to “display some patriotism once in a while.” The climate change debate has nothing to do with patriotism.
At any rate, eventually Watts admits that, “Perhaps it was a mistake for me to pose the question…For that I apologize. I could have phrased it better.”
I wouldn’s say an armistice between the rival climate factions is about to break out, but that was a decent enough olive branch.
Watts is pretty much a teabagger. About ten years ago he ran for school board in Chico on the “oh isn’t that the nice TV weatherman” platform and got elected, but after his views became clear to the voters he bcame unelected four years later.
All of that said, I’m glad it dawned on him that most other people think the teabag stuff is orthogonal to any discussion about climate, however much his instincts may say otherwise.
Steve,
Your comment is just as gratuitously offensive and off topic as Watts’ original post.
“I could have phrased it better” is an olive branch?
Look, I’m all for letting bygones be bygones and moving on. But this is ridiculous. He’s insulted a couple of people in a totally unsupportable and irrelevant way, then turned around and said he might have phrased “it” better? What exactly is “it”? And how is this an attempt at repair?
A simple analogy, taking it only a little bit further:
Mr. YY: “Perhaps it was a mistake when I suggested that Mr. XX was guilty of selling kidnapped children into slavery. … For that I apologize. I could have phrased it better.”
Mr. KK: “That was a decent enough olive branch. Don’t be chrulish, Mr. YY, accept the apology.”
Um, no. I’m all for olive branches, but that wasn’t one. Obviously. What could you possibly be thinking?
Yes, I noticed that weasel word–“perhaps”–but I thought it was more than offset by the words “mistake” and “apology.”
In terms of the nasty and hyper-partisan sewer this debate takes place, that constitutes an olive branch to me. (Not everyone can show the same degree of humility as you, Michael, during such walk-backs.)
BTW, can you point to any occasions where Eli has voiced similar regret over something he wrote?
Off-topic? Literally, no, sorry to have to inform you.
While teabaggers consider teabagger to be an offensive term , I would point out that it’s the one they gave themselves when they first started out. No take-backsies.
Re Watts, are you actually questioning that he has those views?
I am reminded of a now-favorite story:
During the first round of teabag rallies, they had the temerity to hold one in Civic Center in SF (not far from the Castro, where people are fully informed about teabagging). As I was sitting in front of my computer the next morning, reviewing the previous day’s news while drinking my coffee, I saw a photo of the event which prominently featured someone holding a sign reading: “I shaved my balls for this!?”
I swear, it’s the closet I’ve ever come to the proverbial keyboard/coffee interface disaster.
“closest”
I have no knowledge of the closet status of the sign holder. 🙂
If Watts really wanted to offer an olive branch he would edit his original post to remove the offending sentence. He hasn’t done so.
He doesn’t have to edit it, but an update in bold and brackets after the first time he questions their patriotism would have been nice.
Really on topic now, do you suppose Elmer ever called Bugs insufferable? Probably. And it was doubtless twoo.
Watts did not apologize to Eli or Tamino. He apologized to his audience for not stating “it” as effectively as he might have. It is up to his audience to accept that apology. No olive branch has been offered. Rather, he admits that perhaps he should have resorted to sly implication rather than explicit accusation.
I appreciate the kind words about myself. I am willing to make mistakes and willing to acknowledge them when I do. I would like to think that a mistake like Watts’ here is beyond the range of my own fallibility, though.
That said, a proportionate acknowledgement in this case would look like this: “What was I thinking? Of course, agreement with me on climate is not a prerequisite for patriotism, honor, or respect for the sacrifices of those who, through history, have sacrificed themselves for our freedom.”
Not “I could have phrased it better”. Again, what is the “it” supposed to be here?
Personally, I recommend paying no attention to Watts. This event only reinforces that recommendation. I am only concerned with your idea that there has been anything resembling an apology.
People have advised me to not pay attention to Romm, too. That would be a mistake, just as it would be to ignore Watts.
@ keith #8
Something along those lines is what I mean. An apology buried deep in the comment section is essentially meaningless… especially the way it is currently worded.
Re. KK in comment #11 (I think. the numbers get getting squashed in my browser.)
“People have advised me to not pay attention to Romm, too. That would be a mistake, just as it would be to ignore Watts.”
Maybe ignoring Watts is too strong of a verb. Perhaps it is time to stop commenting on his sorry excuse for a “scientific” blog with the intent to bring some real scientific discussion to it and its masses. Obviously this won’t make WUWT go away, but it should lower the collective blood pressure of those who’ve made the attempt.
And while we’re on the subject, I’d like to give Dr. Curry an opportunity to modify her earlier comment (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/2010/04/27/curry-the-backstory/comment-page-2/#comment-3622
“The people slagging off on McIntyre, Watts et al. have probably spent no time over at their blogs or made an effort to get to know them personally and understand what makes them tick. ”
Dr. Curry, now that we have gotten to know Watts better and, I believe, understand what makes him tick, what do you recommend that we do.
BTW, we’re still waiting to see your explanation of why WUWT is worthwhile reading even after Goddard’s laughable attempt to equate the surface temperature on Venus with pumping up a bicycle tire.
So, a post that starts out chastising Watts for writing something foul about Rabett and kinda sorta (but not really) apologizing for it…becomes an opportunity to ask whether *Rabett* has ever offered a regretful ‘olive branch’.
Holy cow.
Who’s doing the education and journalism here, anyway?
I’m reminded somehow of this:
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/bljonstewartcrossfire.htm
That’s an entirely ridiculous statement of Watts, because as you rightly say “The climate change debate has nothing to do with patriotism.”
After “For that I apologize” he should have made a full stop. The sentence thereafter (“I could have phrased it better”) makes the preceding apology moot and fake. There is no way to phrase something like that “better”.
I’d really like to know why it would be an error not to pay any attention to Watts.
Sometimes, I really wonder if it is necessary for strawmen not to exist.
The Rabett rocks. Watts? not so much.
As a Canadian I find American delusions about patriotism bizarre. You guys need less patriotism not more. To quote Shaw:
“Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all others because you were born in it.”
Keith:
I’m mystified. You’d like Eli to offer an olive branch, for parity with the one offered by Watts. First, I’m mystified that you consider Watts burying his ‘apology’ in the comments to be a serious olive branch. Then, that you consider ‘I could have phrased it better’ to be an apology at all. The original statement slanders Eli and Tamino’s patriotism. He does not retract that slander, merely say that he could have phrased it better. Per Brad’s comment, there’s no ambiguity about whether it is a slander.
For the parity you’re looking for, I guess I would indeed encourage Eli to make an equal apology — as soon as you or someone else points to an article of Eli’s where he takes a day which is to honor people who <b>died for their country</b> for, instead, the purpose of patting himself on the back about what a great patriot he is, and then to make personal attacks on people who have nothing whatever to do with the day or its purpose.
Patting himself on the back about his patriotism is tacky. Attacking Eli and Tamino is worse. Standing on the corpses of people who died for their country so that he could do both is completely beyond the pale.
“Patting himself on the back about his patriotism is tacky.”
Remember, he has a cold. He really sacrificed himself for his country by going outside to hang his flag while being ill.
Even if Tamino and Eli flew the flag, he could still claim …
“but … they’re not sick!”